arming iraq

[superkool]

John King

Arming Iraq and the Path to War

A crisis always has a history, and the current crisis with Iraq is no exception. Below are some relevant dates.

September,1980. Iraq invades Iran. The beginning of the Iraq-Iran war. (8)

February, 1982. Despite objections from congress, President Reagan removes Iraq from its list of known terrorist countries. (1)

December, 1982. Hughes Aircraft ships 60 Defender helicopters to Iraq. (9)

1982-1988. Defense Intelligence Agency provides detailed information for Iraq on Iranian deployments, tactical planning for battles, plans for air strikes and bomb damage assessments. (4)

November, 1983. A National Security Directive states that the U.S would do "whatever was necessary and legal" to prevent Iraq from losing its war with Iran. (1) (15)

November, 1983. Banca Nazionale del Lavoro of Italy and its Branch in Atlanta begin to funnel $5 billion in unreported loans to Iraq. Iraq, with the blessing and official approval of the US government, purchased computer controlled machine tools, computers, scientific instruments, special alloy steel and aluminum, chemicals, and other industrial goods for Iraq's missile, chemical, biological and nuclear weapons programs. (14)

October, 1983. The Reagan Administration begins secretly allowing Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and Egypt to transfer United States weapons, including Howitzers, Huey helicopters, and bombs to Iraq. These shipments violated the Arms Export Control Act. (16)

November 1983. George Schultz, the Secretary of State, is given intelligence reports showing that Iraqi troops are daily using chemical weapons against the Iranians. (1)

December 20, 1983 Donald Rumsfeld , then a civilian and now Defense Secretary, meets with Saddam Hussein to assure him of US friendship and materials support. (1) (15)

July, 1984. CIA begins giving Iraq intelligence necessary to calibrate its mustard gas attacks on Iranian troops. (19)

January 14, 1984. State Department memo acknowledges United States shipment of "dual-use" export hardware and technology. Dual use items are civilian items such as heavy trucks, armored ambulances and communications gear as well as industrial technology that can have a military application. (2)

March, 1986. The United States with Great Britain block all Security Council resolutions condemning Iraq's use of chemical weapons, and on March 21 the US becomes the only country refusing to sign a Security Council statement condemning Iraq's use of these weapons. (10)

May, 1986. The US Department of Commerce licenses 70 biological exports to Iraq between May of 1985 and 1989, including at least 21 batches of lethal strains of anthrax. (3)

May, 1986. US Department of Commerce approves shipment of weapons grade botulin poison to Iraq. (7)

March, 1987. President Reagan bows to the findings of the Tower Commission admitting the sale of arms to Iran in exchange for hostages. Oliver North uses the profits from the sale to fund an illegal war in Nicaragua. (17)

Late 1987. The Iraqi Air Force begins using chemical agents against Kurdish resistance forces in northern Iraq. (1)

February, 1988. Saddam Hussein begins the "Anfal" campaign against the Kurds of northern Iraq. The Iraq regime used chemical weapons against the Kurds killing over 100,000 civilians and destroying over 1,200 Kurdish villages. (8)

April, 1988. US Department of Commerce approves shipment of chemicals used in manufacture of mustard gas. (7)

August, 1988. Four major battles were fought from April to August 1988, in which the Iraqis massively and effectively used chemical weapons to defeat the Iranians. Nerve gas and blister agents such as mustard gas are used. By this time the US Defense Intelligence Agency is heavily involved with Saddam Hussein in battle plan assistance, intelligence gathering and post battle debriefing. In the last major battle with of the war, 65,000 Iranians are killed, many with poison gas. Use of chemical weapons in war is in violation of the Geneva accords of 1925. (6) (13)

August, 1988. Iraq and Iran declare a cease fire. (8)

August, 1988. Five days after the cease fire Saddam Hussein sends his planes and helicopters to northern Iraq to begin massive chemical attacks against the Kurds. (8)

September, 1988. US Department of Commerce approves shipment of weapons grade anthrax and botulinum to Iraq. (7)

September 1988. Richard Murphy, Assistant Secretary of State: "The US-Iraqi relationship is... important to our long-term political and economic objectives." (15)

December, 1988. Dow chemical sells $1.5 million in pesticides to Iraq despite knowledge that these would be used in chemical weapons. (1)

July 25, 1990. US Ambassador to Baghdad meets with Hussein to assure him that President Bush "wanted better and deeper relations". Many believe this visit was a trap set for Hussein. A month later Hussein invaded Kuwait thinking the US would not respond. (12)

August, 1990 Iraq invades Kuwait. The precursor to the Gulf War. (8)

July, 1991 The Financial Times of London reveals that a Florida chemical company had produced and shipped cyanide to Iraq during the 80's using a special CIA courier. Cyanide was used extensively against the Iranians. (11)

August, 1991. Christopher Droguol of Atlanta's branch of Banca Nazionale del Lavoro is arrested for his role in supplying loans to Iraq for the purchase of military supplies. He is charged with 347 counts of felony. Droguol is found guilty, but US officials plead innocent of any knowledge of his crime. (14)

June, 1992. Ted Kopple of ABC Nightline reports: "It is becoming increasingly clear that George Bush Sr., operating largely behind the scenes throughout the 1980's, initiated and supported much of the financing, intelligence, and military help that built Saddam's Iraq into [an aggressive power]." (5)

July, 1992. "The Bush administration deliberately, not inadvertently, helped to arm Iraq by allowing U.S. technology to be shipped to Iraqi military and to Iraqi defense factories... Throughout the course of the Bush administration, U.S. and foreign firms were granted export licenses to ship U.S. technology directly to Iraqi weapons facilities despite ample evidence showing that these factories were producing weapons." Representative Henry Gonzalez, Texas, testimony before the House. (18)

February, 1994. Senator Riegle from Michigan, chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, testifies before the senate revealing large US shipments of dual-use biological and chemical agents to Iraq that may have been used against US troops in the Gulf War and probably was the cause of the illness known as Gulf War Syndrome. (7)

August, 2002. "The use of gas [during the Iran-Iraq war] on the battle field by the Iraqis was not a matter of deep strategic concern... We were desperate to make sure that Iraq did not lose". Colonel Walter Lang, former senior US Defense Intelligence officer tells the New York Times. (4)

This chronology of the United States' sordid involvement in the arming of Iraq can be summarized in this way: The United States used methods both legal and illegal to help build Saddam's army into the most powerful army in the Mideast outside of Israel. The US supplied chemical and biological agents and technology to Iraq when it knew Iraq was using chemical weapons against the Iranians. The US supplied the materials and technology for these weapons of mass destruction to Iraq at a time when it was know that Saddam was using this technology to kill his Kurdish citizens. The United States supplied intelligence and battle planning information to Iraq when those battle plans included the use of cyanide, mustard gas and nerve agents. The United States blocked UN censure of Iraq's use of chemical weapons. The United States did not act alone in this effort. The Soviet Union was the largest weapons supplier, but England, France and Germany were also involved in the shipment of arms and technology.

John King
Long Prairie, MN

1. Washingtonpost.com. December 30, 2002
2. Jonathan Broder. Nuclear times, Winter 1990-91
3. Kurt Nimno. AlterNet. September 23, 2002
4. Newyorktimes.com. August 29, 2002
5. ABC Nightline. June9, 1992
6. Counter Punch, October 10, 2002
7. Riegle Report: Dual Use Exports. Senate Committee on Banking. May 25, 1994
8. Timeline: A walk Through Iraq's History. U.S. Department of State
9. Doing Business: The Arming of Iraq. Daniel Robichear
10. Glen Rangwala. Labor Left Briefing, 16 September, 2002
11. Financial Times of London. July 3, 1991
12. Elson E. Boles. Counter Punch. October 10, 2002
13. Iran-Iraq War, 1980-1988. Iranchamber.com
14. Columbia Journalism Review. March/April 1993. Iraqgate
15. Times Online. December 31, 2002. How U.S. Helped Iraq Build Deadly Arsenal
16. Bush's Secret Mission. The New Yorker Magazine. November 2, 1992
17. Grolier Multimedia Encyclopedia: Iran-Contra Affair
18. Congressional Record. July 27, 1992. Representative Henry B. Gonzalez
19. Bob Woodward. CIA Aiding Iraq in Gulf War. Washington Post. 15 December, 1986
20. WWW.gendercide.com http://www.gendercide.com . Case Study: The Anfal Campaign

[ZupanGOD]

?

[Boyd Main]

Wow. That's pretty disturbing reading. I've heard bits and pieces of all that before, but never all together or so extensively.

[ZupanGOD]

Hmm..

http://www.solport.com/resources/Iraqi%20Weapons.JPG
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/Trnd_Ind_IRQ_Imps_73-02.pdf
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/IRQ_IMPRTS_73-02.pdf
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/EB05Ak02.html

Since obviously you guys are intentionally being intellectually dis-honest on the facts here, are you guys illustrating an obvious bias agaisnt the US or is it a flat out anti-American attitude? Which is it cause I'm kind of torn on deciding which of these two discriptions fits your ulterior motive for posting such things here.

Just curious..

-Jason

[Boyd Main]

Originally posted by ZupanGOD

http://www.solport.com/resources/Iraqi%20Weapons.JPG
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/Trnd_Ind_IRQ_Imps_73-02.pdf
http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/IRQ_IMPRTS_73-02.pdf
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/EB05Ak02.html


Those first three links regard conventional weapons, which was not the main point of the initial post.

As to the fact that Germany also supplied Iraq with the supplies for creating WMDs, and perhaps in greater quantities than the US did, well shame on them too. That's not really a defence, though, Jason. It's like a murderer saying "Why are you picking on me, Jeffrey Dahmer was way worse."

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by Boyd Main


Those first three links regard conventional weapons, which was not the main point of the initial post.

Sure it was.. it went into a long laundry list of things including coventional and unconventional weapons. Those Helicopters are a prime example.

As to the fact that Germany also supplied Iraq with the supplies for creating WMDs, and perhaps in greater quantities than the US did, well shame on them too. That's not really a defence, though, Jason. It's like a murderer saying "Why are you picking on me, Jeffrey Dahmer was way worse."

Well going by the facts, the US did not have any role in Iraq developing WMD, the US did however shipped Dual use items to Iraq like many other countries had for the sole perpose of non-weapons such a medical purposes, and agriculture and so forth. then of course you have some countries that flat out provided material and support that was used for weapons. But my whole point is not to refute that the US shipped items that was sent for non-weapon purposes and Iraq decieved everyone and tried using them for weapon use but to point out that it's intellectually dishonest to say it was the US who armed Iraq in the way this thread claims. And to distort the truth and mislead in this dishonest fashion and then are friends here are tripping over themselves to post this information in such a way to me illustrates someones bias against America or is down right anti-American. I just have to question someones ulterior motive sometimes especially since they fall all over themselves posting allot of this nonsense to try to futher their radical views, it's either they don't know better and they are just ignorant of what the facts actually are or they know very well what there doing and such posts such as these do nothing but express such hatred for America. I'm trying to find out which it is. I suppose I think I know where these radicals are comming from but I want to make sure.

Take care,
-Jason

[Boyd Main]

Originally posted by ZupanGOD
But my whole point is ... to point out that it's intellectually dishonest to say it was the US who armed Iraq in the way this thread claims.

Go back and read the final two sentences of the article. I don't think the author was making the claim that the US acted alone, but he has cited many sources (some better than others) which provide evidence that the US was involved in arming and aiding Iraq's military midadventures .

Originally posted by ZupanGOD
And to distort the truth and mislead in this dishonest fashion and then are friends here are tripping over themselves to post this information in such a way to me illustrates someones bias against America or is down right anti-American. I just have to question someones ulterior motive sometimes especially since they fall all over themselves posting allot of this nonsense to try to futher their radical views, it's either they don't know better and they are just ignorant of what the facts actually are or they know very well what there doing and such posts such as these do nothing but express such hatred for America. I'm trying to find out which it is. I suppose I think I know where these radicals are comming from but I want to make sure.
[/B]

It's a fair question. I can't speak for superkool or anyone else but myself, but I can hazard a guess as to what might motivate someone to disseminate such information in such a fashion. Firstly, you've got to remember that most people you interact with are Americans, and therefore they have a vested interest in the actions of this country. They are more likely to be concerned with the misadventures of their own government than those of another nations (Russia or Germany in this case). Add to this a fairly common Americentrism among Americans (beleive me, it's real) and you might see why people focus on the deeds of America.

Now, whether they see those deeds in a positive or negative light will be influenced by too many factors to be able to tease apart, but those who write timelines like the one above, for example, I do not think are neccessarily motivated by hate. Fear, suspicion, and disgust might be motivating. A huge distrust of authority is another clear motivating factor, and that is one which I see to actually be a core American value, at least is was a few centuries ago when this country was founded. In fact, this questioning and super-critical viewpoint could be thought of, not as anit-American, as you suggest, but in fact as supremely American.

Finally, a think people have a right, and in fact an obligation, to critically examine America's role in bringing Iraq to what it became under Saddam, simply because America lead the push to war to topple him.

whadayareckon?

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by Boyd Main


Go back and read the final two sentences of the article. I don't think the author was making the claim that the US acted alone, but he has cited many sources (some better than others) which provide evidence that the US was involved in arming and aiding Iraq's military midadventures.

I did, I still get the impression as a reader that it was the US who armed Saddam. But putting my thinking cap on and using logic here the US being less than 1% of a supplier to Iraq and the stuff being legal shit at that, I just don’t see how someone can honestly see a clear connection of the US “arming” Iraq. The facts don’t support such a claim. I mean I think the US was pretty shy at supplying Iraq at all considering how very little they got. Don’t you know how much military equipment is sold by us Western Countries to others? It would boggle your mind. And do you honestly believe HP had interest in helping a dictator develop weapons? I mean come on, at the most it was a dumb decision on their part thinking that Iraq was just like any other despot in the world who bought their equipment for what it was intended for but little did they know this little despot country was willing to take their equipment and use it for bad intentions.

Boyd I'm wondering if you looked into this information as much as I have. [scratches head]

Here's a better link to it.

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/armIraqP2W.html

Let’s quickly click through some of the sources linked and then you tell me how creditable all this you think is in the first place. At first I glanced at it and I already have looked into these claims and this has all been debunked before, I wasn’t going to even give it the time of day but I looked at the clock and said ahh fuck it I’m not leaving yet and I know this doesn't matter to you guys on the left (shit you guys are still spinning the cold war) but anyways, I went through them, tons of shit from rense/commondreams/alternet’s stuff, now.. read them, tell me if you also think it’s kind of funny to you that this guy writes a timeline and his own inaccurate sources refute his timeline. [lafs]

Anyways.. I'm not saying the US was vacant from Iraq at all, I'm just trying to easily nudge you along here so you don't come off as sitting in the same camp as superkool. I know you know what’s up, you know this is pretty inaccurate. Let the troll own this thread. ;)

It's a fair question. I can't speak for superkool or anyone else but myself, but I can hazard a guess as to what might motivate someone to disseminate such information in such a fashion. Firstly, you've got to remember that most people you interact with are Americans, and therefore they have a vested interest in the actions of this country. They are more likely to be concerned with the misadventures of their own government than those of another nations (Russia or Germany in this case). Add to this a fairly common Americentrism among Americans (beleive me, it's real) and you might see why people focus on the deeds of America.

Now, whether they see those deeds in a positive or negative light will be influenced by too many factors to be able to tease apart, but those who write timelines like the one above, for example, I do not think are neccessarily motivated by hate. Fear, suspicion, and disgust might be motivating. A huge distrust of authority is another clear motivating factor, and that is one which I see to actually be a core American value, at least is was a few centuries ago when this country was founded. In fact, this questioning and super-critical viewpoint could be thought of, not as anit-American, as you suggest, but in fact as supremely American.

Finally, a think people have a right, and in fact an obligation, to critically examine America's role in bringing Iraq to what it became under Saddam, simply because America lead the push to war to topple him.

whadayareckon?

You got all that from reading the article? Damn, what’s his shoe size by the way? Haha! :p

Take care,
Jason

[superkool]

May, 1986. US Department of Commerce approves shipment of weapons grade botulin poison to Iraq. (7)




maybe you missed that jason...oh i love the "dual use, he tricked us, that basterd" thing.......it really sounds good.

hahahaha

and at the same time as this selling arms to iran.....

come on jason.we and alot of other people armed iraq and iran for cash...north for his little war, and those others for whatever reason...but to act like we gave them shit and we didn't know what they were going to use it for?hahahahahahahaha

maybe you missed this

November, 1983. A National Security Directive states that the U.S would do "whatever was necessary and legal" to prevent Iraq from losing its war with Iran. (1) (15)

November, 1983. Banca Nazionale del Lavoro of Italy and its Branch in Atlanta begin to funnel $5 billion in unreported loans to Iraq. Iraq, with the blessing and official approval of the US government, purchased computer controlled machine tools, computers, scientific instruments, special alloy steel and aluminum, chemicals, and other industrial goods for Iraq's missile, chemical, biological and nuclear weapons programs. (14)

October, 1983. The Reagan Administration begins secretly allowing Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and Egypt to transfer United States weapons, including Howitzers, Huey helicopters, and bombs to Iraq. These shipments violated the Arms Export Control Act. (16)

November 1983. George Schultz, the Secretary of State, is given intelligence reports showing that Iraqi troops are daily using chemical weapons against the Iranians. (1)

December 20, 1983 Donald Rumsfeld , then a civilian and now Defense Secretary, meets with Saddam Hussein to assure him of US friendship and materials support. (1) (15)

July, 1984. CIA begins giving Iraq intelligence necessary to calibrate its mustard gas attacks on Iranian troops. (19)


so after knowing they used chems, we sell them more...and the same players in the reagan years...are the same players now....interesting.



did all of them confess to god and want to start over..lets take back what we sold them, so i can die with a clear head?hahahahaha

" they used wmd on their own people" but bush never finishes and says " and then we sold them more and told them how to use it better"


that might be the point jason

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by superkool
May, 1986. US Department of Commerce approves shipment of weapons grade botulin poison to Iraq. (7)

That's where the quote is incorrect, dual use items were shipped, not full blown weaponized botulin. Iraq had one of the highest non-approval rate by US export controls while the rest of the exports to the world averages 5%. The USDOC during the 80's approved 771 dual use items to Iraq and 392 were not approved to Iraq. Dual use items wasn't something exported to soley Iraq, the United States exported dual use items to many countries, the majority of them not even democracies. Many of these dual use items do serve a purpose for civilian use, this is why it's such a problem to deal with. Do you ban all exports of dual use items that have important civilian purposes? Like anthrax, do you not export anything to anyone and say fuck you who cares if your poultry dies from disease and so forth? It's a touchy subject, with hindsight if everyone in the world knew who would and who wouldn't weaponize thes e dual use items we wouldn't be having this discussion obviously. Like we have in North Korea, the Koreans recieved "dual use" items to help them develope Nuclear Energy, well while they had internation inspectors present they still used those "dual use" items to develope nuclear weapons. In Iraq they used the University of Baghdad to front as a civilian purpose for dual use items and then secretley turned around and used their scientists to weaponize these dual use items.

maybe you missed that jason...oh i love the "dual use, he tricked us, that basterd" thing.......it really sounds good.

Well that's what Iraq did.

hahahaha

and at the same time as this selling arms to iran.....

come on jason.we and alot of other people armed iraq and iran for cash...north for his little war, and those others for whatever reason...but to act like we gave them shit and we didn't know what they were going to use it for?hahahahahahahaha

Before the Iraninan Islamic revolution sure the US sold them a good amount of airplanes, the Shah was pro-western at the time. That obviously changed when the Shah were overthrown.

maybe you missed this



so after knowing they used chems, we sell them more...and the same players in the reagan years...are the same players now....interesting.




did all of them confess to god and want to start over..lets take back what we sold them, so i can die with a clear head?hahahahaha

" they used wmd on their own people" but bush never finishes and says " and then we sold them more and told them how to use it better"


that might be the point jason

Well what ever way you want to spin it, the US and western countries exported dual use items for civilian purposes, yet Iraq turned around and weaponized them.

-Jason

[superkool]

so we never sold them any weapons or chems?

and we didn't sell arms to iran during the iraq-iran war? north didn't get in front of congress and say we had sold weapons illegally to iran during this time to help fund the contra's?

wow that was a good show congress put on back then huh?

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by superkool
so we never sold them any weapons or chems?

No, Dual use. The US did not manufactor the weapons grade chemicals and then ship then to Iraq it was Iraq that took those dual use items and converted them from civilian non-military use to weaponized form for military use.

and we didn't sell arms to iran during the iraq-iran war? north didn't get in front of congress and say we had sold weapons illegally to iran during this time to help fund the contra's?

wow that was a good show congress put on back then huh?

Well yeah we swapped for those American hostages correct?

-Jason

[Boyd Main]

Originally posted by ZupanGOD

Well what ever way you want to spin it, the US and western countries exported dual use items for civilian purposes, yet Iraq turned around and weaponized them.


"What ever way you want to spin it, I gave that homocidal maniac an axe only so that he could chop his firewood. Honest."

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by Boyd Main


"What ever way you want to spin it, I gave that homocidal maniac an axe only so that he could chop his firewood. Honest."

Since you wanna spin it.. :D

You could spin above this way too.

I didn't give the people of Iraq the proper tools such as an axe to chop a tree for firewood to heat their homes, so they all died in the cold. Well at least I didn't give them that axe to do it, becuase they might of used it for bad.

Nice try though Boyd. I give an A+ for effort. :D

Maybe you and your radical friends should do a little more research and learn about how different chemicals that are often used everyday around the world for agriculture, medicine, livestock, etc, etc. can be turned into bad use. Have fun researching guys..

Ohh BTW, this is subject releated... check it out.

http://www.techcentralstation.com/1051/defensewrapper.jsp?PID=1051-350&CID=1051-050803A

[burnt]

so..........quick question for both Boyd and Zupan......you're arguing about this "going out and buying an axe metaphor"......um, GOOD METAPHOR!!!

what are your thoughts, about madmen and honest men, buying WMD from American corporations, as easily as some homicidial maniac, and some soccer dad, can buy axes at the local Home Depot?



aren't our Joint Chiefs of Staff supposed to be smarter & more proactive than that? I mean, thats why the CEO of the Pentagon, is the CEO of the Pentagon, and not some lame-assed, small-sighted corporation like Home Depot.

anyway, talk amongst yourselves.........

[ZupanGOD]

Originally posted by burnt
what are your thoughts, about madmen and honest men, buying WMD from American corporations, as easily as some homicidial maniac, and some soccer dad, can buy axes at the local Home Depot?

What do you mean? I think this kinda falls into the same context of what I was asking.. in hindsight it was a stupid thing todo, but I am wondering back then while exporting dual use chemicals would of it been just as stupid to fuck the civilians over by blocking dual use items that were used for good? The world defintley didn't think so at the time.

-Jason